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Comment by Carma Poodale Allen on April 16, 2013 at 4:21pm

Is anyone going to the Animal care expo in Nashville tenn? Its May 8-11 at the Gaylord Opry Land resorts Animal Care Expo. My ma Bunny will be there and was hoping one of you would be there to meet up. 

Comment by Kathy H Porter on March 11, 2013 at 6:16am

You (the generic "you" because from everyone's comments here, you guys have already chosen) have to 'pick your battles" no matter what the cause. I think that in the end, No Kill shelters are going to be the norm, we just have to put all of the components together. One of the things I've always thought would be a step in that direction would be to launch a town-by-town education platform about the benefits of the CGC (Canine Good Citizens evaluation) for each household that has a dog(s). Pet owners who bring legitimate proof of this certification to their town's clerks office - where dogs are licensed - pay a slightly less fee for registered their dogs w/the town. (Say, $10.00 instead of $15.00 or whatever the rate is.) That $5.00 difference goes into a fund that goes toward ___________ and that blank space is where it gets interesting. Could that money go toward spay/neuter? Could it be used to help make the reality of a No Kill shelter in that town come closer to happening? A town's commitment to educating everyone about the benefits of that CGC would certainly have some long term effects that would bring us closer to the larger goal.

Comment by Katie on March 10, 2013 at 8:17pm

Carma I absolutely agree that if we are ever going to reach a No Kill Nation we have to change the thinking of people like the vet you mention. They should try volunteering or working in a no kill shelter and see just "miserable" the majority of those animals are. Shelter life is not ideal, but if it is in a decent shelter staffed with loving, compassionate individuals who know how to provide proper care for the animals and help them overcome the trauma of being in a shelter, well that is better than no life at all.

Kathy, I am fascinated and disturbed by the stories Nathan Winograd has on his blog. I follow his Facebook, but I can't read his blog most of the time, I just get too upset at some of the animal control facilities. It breaks my heart that people with no compassion would be working with the animals.

I was at an animal communication class today, so it was filled with animal lovers and animal rescuers. At the very end one of the ladies there was talking about a cat she had in her care. Apparently the cat has some behavior issues, in part because of bullying from another cat, in part from neglect on the part of a previous owner. This lady said if the man doesn't come get them by April 1, she is having the cat put down. I was appalled. It must be a stressful situation for everyone, but I cant imagine putting a cat down for that reason. How is euthanizing ever an option!?

Comment by Carma Poodale Allen on March 10, 2013 at 7:37am

Hi Kathy, I am a big reader of the No Kill Advocacy Center. I also visit their website often to read. Thanks for participating in the conversation.

Have a great day!  

Comment by Kathy H Porter on March 10, 2013 at 5:32am

I've been following your email thread and it's only now that I have time to participate. A couple of years ago, I read Nathan Winograd's book, "The Myth of Overpopulation and the No Kill Revolution in America." I'm in the middle of reading his latest: Irreconcilable Differences. I've learned never to assume, so I'm offering this just in case you guys don't know about this man. And, as an added bit of info, here's the link to the FB page for the No Kill Advocacy Center: https://www.facebook.com/nokilladvocacycenter

Comment by Carma Poodale Allen on March 9, 2013 at 7:54pm

Katie, the comment on warehousing pets was in reference to having pets in ones shelter for such a long time that they become like stock in a warehouse. I have seen many pets that have been in a home for all their lives come in to the shelter and yes they are sad , depressed and really broken hearted. You would feel the same way if it happened to you, I know I would be. But those are the ones that our staff and volunteers really work with. The comment that in a way angered me , yet caused me to think about what the warehouse meant is as follows:

Their words were:

 I am extremely grateful to work for a shelter that does all they can to help, adopt, or place any animal they possibly can. I am also grateful they refuse to "warehouse" animals and allow them to live in a shelter for years without a forever home. Life in a shelter is no life at all. After tomorrow I will have the certification to end suffering, whether it is medical or mental, in the most humane and compassionate way possible.

The sad part is that this person has never volunteered at a No Kill. They have always volunteered with animal control. 

I don't think we will ever achieve being a no kill nation until we change these individuals way of thinking. To me this was a jab at no kill shelters. Shelter life may not be the grandest life but its the best one that most of them have until their forever home is found. Some wait days . some wait months and some wait years.A good no kill will make sure that no matter what the amount of time is, they offer them love, care and show them they are worth something. 

Comment by vinnythepug on March 9, 2013 at 4:35pm

 

Tomorrow I will continue this conversation.  Now however, please enjoy this video which is pertinent to my answers to the problem of killing healthy pets.

---Vinny---

Comment by Katie on March 9, 2013 at 12:28pm

Carma, curious what you mean by "warehousing pets". Do you mean like an animal control facility where the animals are just crammed in little cages as close together as possible? Which is what I think you mean.

I don't think this is the option. As Vinny said yesterday, the animals need to have a destination, or at least the possibility of a destination. I worked for a large cageless, no kill cat shelter in Chicago for many years. Many of the cats who lived there spent or will spend the rest of their lives there. They get to move around, have other kitty friends, build relationships with humans and enjoy the life a cat is meant to live. So even those who are destined to live out their days there have a quality life. That is, of course, an ideal situation that many shelters simply cannot obtain. Vinny is also correct in saying that organizations that "warehouse" pets don't give the animals long to live, so there is little chance of the animals finding a home and I would think little chance of many of them spiriling downward as the vet you mention said. I have seen many animals spiral downward after being admitted to a shelter, but how much of that is from "warehousing" and how much of that is simply from losing their home and their family? How many of us would do the same thing?

I think part of the solution is finding ways to keep animals out of shelters in the first place. Providing services such as pet food pantries and low cost basic veterinary services are great ways to help those who have animals they love but simply cannot afford to keep them in this horrible economy. Providing access to basic behavioral counseling as well, so that those annoying behavior issues can be resolved before they finally send mom or dad over the edge to relinquish the animals can help too.

Comment by Carma Poodale Allen on March 8, 2013 at 8:44am

Thank you for sharing your thoughts on this matter, Vinny. I agree that No Kill does not mean warehousing pets. During a recent conversation which sparked this blog I received this comment from a veterinarian  " I have also seen animals spiral downward when housed in warehousing conditions in shelters. Too close confinement, disease, lack of physical contact all contribute to behavioral and physical issues. As a veterinarian, I've been a person asked to weigh in on this topic. And sometimes humane euthanasia is an answer. Not popular, but an answer."

This is disheartening to me that a vet feels this way. I replied that a shelter whether it is a no kill or a kill is as only as good as the staff members and volunteers allow it to be. 

My Humane Society works very hard at helping our county to be a no kill county but when you have vets and shelters who euthanize fighting against you , it makes it very difficult to achieve, 

I look forward to meeting you at Blogpaws and hearing about your quest. This Ky girl could use more information on how to change the minds of others who think euthanasia is the answer to shelter problems. Education is my first weapon of choice.

Thank you so much for giving me your incite. I hope you have a pawsome day. 

Carma Poodale 

Spokesdog for the Owensboro Humane Society 

a NO KILL Facility in Owensboro KY. 

Comment by vinnythepug on March 8, 2013 at 7:01am

What a great question Carma Poodale Allen.  "Does NO-KILL Mean Wearhousing Pets?"  I hope it is alright for me to cross post a reply as this is a subject which I'm dedicating the remainder of my career to. 

 

In my opinion, the short answer is "no".  My definition of "NO-KILL" is that it is a "destination" in the future.  Upon reaching that destination, the majority of the organized groups involved in the support and protection of pets and animals will have migrated away from their former "donations based" fundraisers to adopt new "proactive" fundraisers that are immune from economic factors such as the sequester, inflation, stagflation and downturns.  Fact is, there is an inverse correlation between worsening economies and the number of pets entering shelters.  In English, just as people's capacity to donate is reduced, many loose the ability to keep their pets and they turn them in.

 

Getting back to your original question about "warehousing".  Actually, there is no warehousing because pets are given a very short time to become adopted before they are euthanized in too many shelters. 

We are the creators of 21st Century Fundraiser Models that are 100% Immune from all negative influences.  "Team Vinny" is excited and honored to be participating at our upcoming "BLOGPAWS 2013" where we will be sharing more information about our quest to help move the U.S. and Canada

towards 100% NO-KILL by 2020. 

 

My 100 City Fundraiser Tour of the U.S. and Canada will kickoff between the 1 and 15th of April.  Oklahoma City and Tulsa are  the first two cities our team will visit.  If you'd like to discuss the possibility of our team coming to conduct a fundraiser seminar and hold a joint fundraiser with regional rescues, then send us an email.

Vinny the Pug's NO-KILL 2020

 

Thank you so much for that thought provoking question Carma and welcome to "BlogPaws".  Oh!  I hope to get a chance to meet you at our conference.  Take care.

 

Vincent Thomas Pug

aka "Vinny the Pug"

 

 

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